Improving mat insulation for winter

Discussion in 'Sleep Mats' started by el manana, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    For winter, I use a TAR Neoair with 0.8metre length of standard CCF underneath (doubles as my Prophet backpad). It weighs 100g.
    At -2C, I could clearly feel a bit of cold where the CCF ended just below hips, fine above.

    Anyone got any suggestions for what i could put under the Neoair that is closer to full length and would insulate as well as the CCF for a similar weight?

    hillwalker66 likes this.
  2. Stephen

    Stephen Trail Blazer

    I don't think you will do for anything at that weight El.
  3. edh

    edh Thru Hiker

    I've used a GG Thinlight under a Neoair and found it OK into the low minus numbers.

    Depends what bag you are in too though.
    el manana likes this.
  4. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    I use 3mm CCF laminated to Mylar, they come as Picnic Blankets and cost about 99p last time I got them. 70x 180cm, weigh 70g each. 2 of them keep me warm under my airmat down to around -5c, 1 will do a ground frost.
    el manana likes this.
  5. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    Bag was a PD600.

    That rings a bell Teepee, got a link? Think you gave me one before.
  6. fluffkitten

    fluffkitten Moderator Staff Member

    Shiny thing directly under an airmat can work well, never tried it with a Neoair though.
    el manana likes this.
  7. Mole

    Mole Thru Hiker

    I use radiator foam - mylar bonded to a sort of ccf - the soft white stuff. Comes in a 50cm x 5m roll - £5-£7. Very light.

    Or for colder times 3mm ccf- multimat tent underlay. Comes 1.5m wide by the metre. 0.75m is a nice winter width.
    el manana likes this.
  8. edh

    edh Thru Hiker

    You could always borrow my downmat ;)
    kiltedpict and Munro277 like this.
  9. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    Too heavy :yuck:
    Diddi likes this.
  10. Munro277

    Munro277 Thru Hiker

    But ohh so comfy and warm
    edh, kiltedpict and el manana like this.
  11. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    It does El, sure I remember posting it before and Moles rad reflector being almost identical. This looks v similar, can't find the old link;

    In addition to all that, have you seen the Gossamer gear thinlight pads? I think Paul has one and can comment on weight/warmth.
  12. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    Cheers yeah Ed mentioned that stuff, im sure somewhere sells it by the metre as well. @Robin may have mentioned it once?..

    Ive just remembered i have some laminate floor under insulation (about 2mm?..) in the loft, somebody mentioned that ages ago.
  13. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    IIRC, it's made by Zote-foams; called Evazote?
    el manana likes this.
  14. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    Teepee likes this.
  15. widu13

    widu13 Ultralighter

    A survival blanket works wonders underneath an airmat. I've often wondered why their use aren't more often promoted? You can get 2 from the poundshop or if you fancy a bargain; 2 from the 99p store.
    el manana likes this.
  16. bumbly

    bumbly Section Hiker

    Just saw this thread I use one of these to very good effect to supplement a short (non winter pro lite).

    I've used heavier evazote( both in thickness and density; there are a number of specs) alone in really really cold temps. I reckon this lightweight Vaude mat with the thermarest on top is easily "warm" down to about -8C, and probably get you through the night but possibly, unhappily, at -15C. I'm not sure how an inflatable proper would work with it. I suspect it might not be quite the same sum effect as some heat might bleed out at the side and some internal convection might facilitate that.

    The only less than positive thing I would say about the Vaude mat is it appears to be the lowest of density evazotes. It might not last very long. Certainly a couple of months of heavy use. But the high density stuff I have struggled to punch a hole into with ice tools. With this I almost cut a section through pushing in my plastic poop trowel with it rolled tight. Being a bit more squidgy than the high density ones it might flatten out under a shoulder or hip and be quite cool if used alone.
    el manana likes this.
  17. Robin

    Robin Moderator Staff Member

    I use tent underlay from Needlesports 150x45cm weighs approx 100g. I combine it with a Thermarest XLite. Regular or short depending on season. Works for me.
    Lady Grey and el manana like this.
  18. Whiteburn

    Whiteburn Thru Hiker

    I use a similar system; 0.9m length CFF mat burrito as a 'frame' for the Exodus & in the winter I'll carry a 0.6m length of thinner CCF mat externally as a sit mat; combined they give almost a full length CCF mat for under the Synmat.

    IMG_2004 (Medium).JPG

    I've found the cheapo blue CCF ones take a permanent fold if left folded for a few days with some weight on it making it easier to pack.
    rikdon, Teepee, Mole and 1 other person like this.
  19. fluffkitten

    fluffkitten Moderator Staff Member

    They have limits as I found out one chilly night but are surprisingly useful for extending a plain old airmat's usefulness. :D

    My Tread-lite shiny groundsheet would have worked better if I'd gone SIM -> shiny thing -> airmat rather than having the SIM on top. Should really just buy myself something warm. :)
    el manana likes this.
  20. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    Thanks all, give me plenty to look at.
  21. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    An Easter loft clear out found two different grades of laminate floor underlay.
    A piece of 3mm barrier (quite tough) cut 55cm x 160cm only weighs 62grams :) A bit bulky but I reckon I can fold it into suspension upgrade on the MLD Prophet and use it instead of the inflatable pad.

    Thanks for the suggestions.
    Teepee likes this.
  22. Teepee

    Teepee Thru Hiker

    How does this compare to the windscreen stuff? It's roughly equal in gsm. Is it a better quality foam?

    I'm tempted to try and have a look for some thicker/wider/higher quality.... have seen some 5mm thick with a black foam. @Mole linked to harder wearing underlay (2mm) from Wickes.
  23. el manana

    el manana Thru Hiker

    That barrier stuff looks about 3mm @Teepee i thinks its the mid-range underlay (the cheap one is easily rip foam - no good, the top range i think is the 5mm black one you describe).

    It has like a glossy smooth finish on upper side, I would say its probably better quality and more hard wearing than windscreen stuff but I dont trash my gear or use it loads. I think i got it from our local floors r us shop, a couple of quid a linear metre.
    Teepee likes this.
  24. FOX160

    FOX160 Thru Hiker

    Try an emergency blanket between the foam pad and the actual sleeping mat
    I have laid my emergency blanket over the top of my mat once, due the pad
    wasn’t warm enough and worked.
    Also placed an emergency blanket over my sleeping bag once but be warned the bag
    becomes damp through condensation but got me a nights sleep.
    Mainly now in colder temps I use my Klymit v lite insulite and place a radiator reflective
    coating on 3mm foam under the mat.
  25. Enzo

    Enzo Thru Hiker

    If its that cold better perhaps to wrap safety blanket around yourself as s vapour barrier and then get in your sleeping bag :)
    FOX160 likes this.

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