Bivouak biodegradebale soap

[Heltrekker]

https://www.bivouak-paris.com/products/savon-multiusage-biodegradable

I'm always a bit concerned about washing myself or my kit when wild camping as there never seems to be a good selection of real biodegradable soaps. I heard about this stuff from a French hiker this summer and thought I'd give it a go. It's a multipurpose organic biodegradable soap which apparently can be used for face, body, clothes, washing up, shaving cream and even toothpaste. It gets good reviews in France, and the guy I spoke to swears by it. It's not cheap at 15.90€ for 100ml, but it saves having to take different packs for showergel, toothpaste, soap flakes etc.

And since I bought one, the nice people in Paris sent me a link to share to give anyone I recommend it to 8€ off which should cancel out the UK delivery!

http://i.refs.cc/c3jAZqwt?smile_ref=eyJzbWlsZV9zb3VyY2UiOiJzbWlsZV91aSIsInNtaWxlX21lZGl1bSI6IiIsInNtaWxlX2NhbXBhaWduIjoicmVmZXJyYWxfcHJvZ3JhbSIsInNtaWxlX2N1c3RvbWVyX2lkIjpudWxsfQ==

 

[edh]

No doubt lovely... it is of course soap, 'real biodegradeable' or not...not in essence.
I use soap occasionally, and cathole waste water...its not 'leave no trace' though...
I'll climb down from my hypocritical high horse now ....although the rarefied air of self-satisfaction was enervating..

 

[cathyjc]

I always understood if disposing of "tainted" (ie soapy) water you should spread it over as wide an area as possible - without contaminating water sources.
It gives the soil microbes an easier chance to break down "whatever" ?

Particularly important around bothies - as otherwise a small limited area around the bothy ends up with a high concentration of waste water.
Same as "don't piddle round the back wall of the bothy".
Always bury your No 2's

 

[Heltrekker]

No doubt lovely... it is of course soap, 'real biodegradeable' or not...not in essence.
I use soap occasionally, and cathole waste water...its not 'leave no trace' though...

I always understood if disposing of "tainted" (ie soapy) water you should spread it over as wide an area as possible - without contaminating water sources.
It gives the soil microbes an easier chance to break down "whatever" ?

Likewise!!!

The "soap" ingredient is Disodium Cocoyl Glutamate, originates from coconuts and is a mild surfactant. The most detailed French review I read says it doesn't produce much foam at all, but the reviewer still managed to shave efficiently with it, and confirmed it worked fine as toothpaste.

Bivouak publish a full list of ingredients (I know I've had enough of confinement 'cos I looked them all up ) which are all natural and plant based, not a list of isopropylwhatnots, and they state the product is lab tested as 100% biodegradable - something I'm slightly more inclined to believe since you can use it as toothpaste. Regardless, still need to dispose of any waste water responsibly!!

 

[Baldy]

Likewise!!!

The "soap" ingredient is Disodium Cocoyl Glutamate, originates from coconuts and is a mild surfactant. The most detailed French review I read says it doesn't produce much foam at all, but the reviewer still managed to shave efficiently with it, and confirmed it worked fine as toothpaste.

Bivouak publish a full list of ingredients (I know I've had enough of confinement 'cos I looked them all up ) which are all natural and plant based, not a list of isopropylwhatnots, and they state the product is lab tested as 100% biodegradable - something I'm slightly more inclined to believe since you can use it as toothpaste. Regardless, still need to dispose of any waste water responsibly!!

And the container

 

[Taz38]

Lots of nice homemade 'natural' soaps on offer from various outlets. Wouldn't brush my teeth with them though.

 

[Enzo]

I don't do long trips so 'washing' er.... no.

Shocked that some could desecrate our sacred wild places with chemicals just to smell less

Not really but makes sense to try and find the least harmful way of washing. I'd be interested to hear people's takes.


Something to be said for not removing the oils from your skin that your body goes to the effort of producing not for no reason though.

 

[Heltrekker]

I don't do long trips so 'washing' er.... no.

Shocked that some could desecrate our sacred wild places with chemicals just to smell less

Not really but makes sense to try and find the least harmful way of washing. I'd be interested to hear people's takes.


Something to be said for not removing the oils from your skin that your body goes to the effort of producing not for no reason though.

I do a two week trip every year (when I haven't smashed my fingers, that is...) After two weeks, I'd probably need industrial decontamination, even if I stop a couple of times at refuges!! After 3 days without a wash I can't stand the smell of myself and in summer, if you can't wash yer undies properly, rinsing just isn't enough - the residual oils and salt can start to chafe (I speak from experience ). And I can't do without cleaning my teeth every day - even when I worked in the middle of nowhere in West Africa with rationed water!! Since I do feel the need to wash at least every third day, I'd rather use a product that's as low impact as possible.

 

[Teepee]

A tub of this is always in the house. I wash all my wool and technical kit in it in the washing machine, have done for a few years now and also use it as hand soap. Sleep mats, tents, sleeping bags etc, they all get washed in it.
It goes on longer trips where I'm having to wash kit. Invaluable on the last 5 weeker.
It seems really similar to Dr Bronners but with no smell other than soap, and it rinses as well as Nikwax Techwash.

£30 for 5l.

 

[Baldy]

Would these be better? Pack in, pack out and compost.

 

[Heltrekker]

Would these be better? Pack in, pack out and compost.View attachment 27717

Can't wash yer keks with those though!!!!!!

 

[tom]

Living in rural south india, all waste water (except toilets which goes into a septic tank first) is used for irrigation purposes. One learns prettty quickly to avoid petrochemical products since the effects rather obvious. Outdoor showers are also common where the water goes straight into surrounding flowers. I can therefore vouch that Chandrika soap has no observable negative effects on vegetation even in very high concentration over many years. Chandrika is a plant based ayurvedic soap. I still wouldn't put into open water or running streams.

Its a medical soap, and makes for pretty effective skin care for ailments such as cracked skin or athletes foot. And you can leave all your moisturing creams at home....

 

[Mole]

I wash my nether regions daily. (And hands of course). As a minimum. I sometimes use a small amount of liquid or bar soap . Well away from watercourses

I carry a little bag with a few sheets of moist tp which I occasionally use for a wipe around when in the tent and can't be bothered to wash properly.


@Heltrekker soap looks interesting. Not heard of that source before.

Castile soap like DrBronners leaves me feeling sticky . Not a fan.

 

[cathyjc]

I don't do long trips so 'washing' er.... no.

Shocked that some could desecrate our sacred wild places with chemicals just to smell less

Not really but makes sense to try and find the least harmful way of washing. I'd be interested to hear people's takes.


Something to be said for not removing the oils from your skin that your body goes to the effort of producing not for no reason though.

Not about smelling less - more about personal hygiene. Especially your under carriage - rinsed every day and soaped occasionally.
Underwear - 2 days max and it needs changed/washed.
I also have to wear a medical support stocking which needs changing every 2 days and washed. Without it my leg would swell too much to walk.
Socks - not so much - I just put up with the stink as the boots probably smell awful too and not much I can do about that.
But feet - they do get looked after .

I agree tho' about the rest of me - I'll go a week without soap - sorry if I smell but wild water in Scotland is pretty chilly .

 

[Masca]

The packaging on liquid soaps is always off-putting I think. A card/paper sleeve is so much better. Chandrika sounds interesting.

I know that I'm new here, but... I've just read the power bank thread and this thread back to back. It seems ironic perhaps that people worry about a tiny amount of carefully disposed of soap residue, but owning multiple power banks and cables...

 

[Heltrekker]

Living in rural south india, all waste water (except toilets which goes into a septic tank first) is used for irrigation purposes. One learns prettty quickly to avoid petrochemical products since the effects rather obvious. Outdoor showers are also common where the water goes straight into surrounding flowers. I can therefore vouch that Chandrika soap has no observable negative effects on vegetation even in very high concentration over many years. Chandrika is a plant based ayurvedic soap. I still wouldn't put into open water or running streams.
View attachment 27718
Its a medical soap, and makes for pretty effective skin care for ailments such as cracked skin or athletes foot. And you can leave all your moisturing creams at home....

Looks interesting. Is this the same thing? Found this from a French bio supplier.

https://www.nature-et-forme.com/p/3...HXv-ieG0Zx3IerhbAJRZJ3CXlNyQGyUsaAjBpEALw_wcB

 

[Heltrekker]

I know that I'm new here, but... I've just read the power bank thread and this thread back to back. It seems ironic perhaps that people worry about a tiny amount of carefully disposed of soap residue, but owning multiple power banks and cables...

True! I have one power bank, I take it in case of emergency if I'm doing a trip not involving stops near refuges. Usually, I only take a phone charger. I power off during the day, just check next day's weather in the evening and quick text home to assure the family I haven't been kidnapped by yetis - only have to charge every 5 days or so and I try and coincide with a refuge stop. I take my kindle with me and use it in aircraft mode, power it down when I'm not using it, which gives me about 3 weeks use if I just read for an hour or two a night. I don't miss TV etc. - I go into the hills to get away from all that!!!

 

[Shewie]

I bought a bottle of Dr Bronners in 2009 and I'm still on the same bottle, it seems to last forever

 

[tom]

View attachment 27719
Looks interesting. Is this the same thing? Found this from a French bio supplier.

https://www.nature-et-forme.com/p/3...HXv-ieG0Zx3IerhbAJRZJ3CXlNyQGyUsaAjBpEALw_wcB

Yeah its supposed to be the same recipe - the square shaped ones (my pic) is the original which is nowadays only made in Kerala it seems. Not sure what the deal is but something to do with licencing I read. Both are usually on sale on ebay.

By the way, its a pant based soap - don't leave it sitting in water as it will desolve (wet packing is ok). I use the "leftover" pieces to reshape into small round cakes that fit in little alu tins for hiking and traveling...

 

[Baldy]

Yeah its supposed to be the same recipe - the square shaped ones (my pic) is the original which is nowadays only made in Kerala it seems. Not sure what the deal is but something to do with licencing I read. Both are usually on sale on ebay.

By the way, its a pant based soap - don't leave it sitting in water as it will desolve (wet packing is ok). I use the "leftover" pieces to reshape into small round cakes that fit in little alu tins for hiking and traveling...

Available in the UK. £1.38 a bar

 

[Bmblbzzz]

Available in the UK. £1.38 a bar

Currently out of stock, unfortunately: https://www.worldsend.co.uk/genuine-chandrika-ayurvedic-soap-229-p.asp

 

[Heltrekker]

Currently out of stock, unfortunately: https://www.worldsend.co.uk/genuine-chandrika-ayurvedic-soap-229-p.asp

Managed to get hold of some from a French site, paid €7.50 for 3, just waiting to give it a try.

 

[Daymoth]

My understanding was that all soaps were contaminants, only that the biodegradable ones can be broken down by the bacterias in sewage plants.

Is that incorrect?

 

[Heltrekker]

Most ordinary soaps are bad news, from what I've researched, anything that has phosphates, surfactants, triclosans, or antibacterials in it should be avoided. I look for soaps made from natural ingredients - Bivouak and Chandrika are both made with natural plant based ingredients which theoretically should break down very rapidly. I usually dig a small hole to pour away any used water anyway, but I'm pretty sure it would break down quicker if it was exposed to the sun and elements.

 

[gixer]

As someone that had a unhealthy obsession with Italian cars and motorbikes in his youth, i can attest, everything is biodegradable, it's just a matter of time and conditions, even nuclear waste

Most of the strongest poisons are from plants

"Bio" this, "natural" that it's all marketing BS


Just wash away from a water source and use minimum products and spread it around the area, it really doesn't matter (unless you're a marketing company)

BTW
There are very many plants and trees that are extremely poisonous to fish
So "natural" does not mean it is not harmful

I don't think burying it in a hole is a good idea
1/ You're getting closer to the water source i.e. less natural filtration
2/ You're removing the possibility of UV light doing it's job of breaking up the compounds and sterilising any contaminants you've introduced into the system